6 Responses to “Discussing “Sex and the City””

1. Elizabeth November 4th, 2009 at 8:32 am

   My favorite feminist shows? Cagney & Lacey. Murphy Brown, at least for the first few years. Roseanne. Yeah, I’m old. I also really loved The Days and Nights of Molly Dodd, but it’s a little early in the morning for me to do an in-depth feminist analysis of why.

   I don’t have HBO, so I only saw Sex and the City in hotel rooms, but at the time it struck me as being a lot like Friends, but with swearing. And Friends is not, by any stretch of the imagination, a feminist show.

   And of course, I was a huge fan of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, both the TV show and the original movie. Campy as it was, the film had a terrific feminist coming-of-age subtext.

2. Miss Wizzle November 4th, 2009 at 10:16 am

   I wonder frequently where we draw our “feminist lines” in the sand. When does something (or someone) cross the line from feminist to not-feminist, or vice versa.

   That was kind of my idea in creating this site, to look for the feminist themes in media, not for feminist vs. non-feminist media because feminism means something a little different to each person.

   I never got into Sex and the City either. I’m sure that there are empowering themes (sex positivity is always helpful, to an extent anyway), but there are also some harmful ones involved (materialism, self-centeredness). I’m currently watching 30Rock and have mixed feelings about it, too, but that’s a post for another time.

3. Sara November 4th, 2009 at 8:37 pm

   Like you said, “Sex and the City” did have its moments. I only ended up watching it in syndication, which meant it was heavily edited and I definitely wasn’t getting the whole picture, but from what I saw of it, I can get on board with the idea of it as a feminist show to an extent.

   General thoughts (these certainly aren’t organized too well):

   - I’m pretty sure the show isn’t centered on Carrie’s job; I would argue that it’s centered on her love life and, in a close second, on her relationships with her best friends. I mean, yes, each show is laced through with with her writing, so that alludes to her career. However, her job is itself centered on her love life, and I perceived that the excerpts from her articles really just served as literary devices. Basically, I don’t think your classmate’s reasoning is sound.

   - How often did the show address the concerns of minority women, of poor women, of abused women? I don’t think there can be any question that the show was classist, and I’m not comfortable wholeheartedly calling a show “feminist” if it only covers the pretty, rich, educated, urban women. I enjoy the show (much to my husband’s chagrin, I assure you), and I think there are feminist lessons to be had here and there, but from a political standpoint – my verdict is “not a feminist show.”

   - And now if I may contradict myself a bit … in a cultural way, I do see “Sex and the City” as feminist to an extent. It validates and places importance on women’s words and choices, which counts as feminist to me. I think that’s one of the most vague and, yet, most vital goals of feminism: to let men and women and societies know that they need to listen and respect the things women say in a way that’s equal to the things men say.

   This comment was long-winded and pretty much stream of consciousness! Thanks for writing this and getting my mind going. I’ve been reading for about a month now and loving it.

4. Alethea Joy November 5th, 2009 at 9:36 pm

   I loved reading these responses!

   Elizabeth – you named some great shows. I spent some time over the summer really getting into Murphy Brown, and I’ve only seen one episode of Cagney & Lacey but I had to read this super interesting journal article about it in two different classes. It’s definitely something I’d want to check out in the future.

   Sara – You made some great points. I especially liked your last one about how “Sex and the City” validates women’s voices. That’s definitely something that shouldn’t be overlooked, and I thank you for bringing it up.

   As one of my roommates pointed out to me, it’s really hard to look back at the show now with the movie and everything and truly appreciate the cultural context in which it came. It was really quite revolutionary in certain ways, and while it may have backpedalled on some of its more feminist aspects, that doesn’t mean it wasn’t important and meaningful to many.

   Miss Wizzle – I can’t really comment on “30 Rock” (although I do really want to get into it… or so I say) but lately I’ve been in love with community and the self-proclaimed feminist Britta is one of my favorite things about it. The show has firmly established her as a romantic interest of Joel McHale’s character, but her independence and outspoken honesty is really fun to watch.

5. draconismoi November 9th, 2009 at 10:25 pm

   Sex and the City is one of those shows that test the limits of my feminism. Yes, it does validate women’s voices – and its success goes a long way towards proving that women are a very powerful audience.

   Logic aside, I utterly and completely loathe every single aspect of the show. The privilege, the obsession with finding The Perfect Man, the superficial focus on clothes/shoes….

   Shudder. I’ve sat through many an episode with addicted roommates and hope never to suffer again. I think watching more than one episode of that drivel is giving it more than enough of a chance.

   @Elizabeth – I loved Roseanne too! And (though I am not sure what my 6-year-old self was so fascinated by) The Golden Girls.

   As for feminist shows I love….I’ve found very few that lack any cringeworthy moments, plotlines, or characters. But I’m usually very forgiving as long as the overall tone of the show feels feminist.

   I would wholeheartedly recommend Firefly and The Middleman with almost no reservations regarding race, class or gender. Buffy, Dark Angel, 30 Rock, Dead Like Me, Doctor Who/Torchwood/Sarah Jane Adventures, The Sarah Connor Chronicles, Veronica Mars, La Femme Nikita, Dexter, Battlestar Galactica, Farscape, Better Off Ted and Mad Men are all great shows with a couple sticking points that I’m largely willing to overlook in favor of the awesome.

   Despite my obvious fondness for science fiction, I had to abandon Heroes due to its treatment of women. They had a great idea in the first season – and failed to fix The Woman Problem in the second, despite the showrunner acknowledging it.

   I still feel terrible for not supporting Pushing Daisies. It had a great premise, but the creepy stalker-like ‘romances’ on the show just freaked me out. I feel similarly guilty for not really liking The Gilmore Girls. There was just too much obsession with the menz for my taste. Oh and The L Word – wanted to like it, hated the soap opera drama.

   As I think about it now, the biggest sin a show can commit is to have some awesome female characters, and then derail them into nothing more than romance-obsessed love interests. And that is where I leave in disgust.

6. Elizabeth November 10th, 2009 at 6:42 am

   @draconismoi – Veronica Mars! I forgot how much I loved that show. I loved that her superpower was her big giant brain, and that she was a teenage girl shown with some depth and complexity to her character. Also liked her sense of humor and awareness of class relations.